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Sacramento, Ca USA

I attempted to germinate 10 seeds.,8 Atlantic Giants and 2 unknown. I had an 80% germination rate, 7 Atlantic Gianta and 1 unknown. The problem is that 6 of the plants, all Atlantic Giants, had thick,white, leathery patches in the center of both seed leaves that covered anywhere from 25-80% of the leaf. When i germinated the seeds I filed the edges, soaked for 2 hours, placed them in papertowels and sealed them in baggies. I places a germination heat mat in a dark cupboard, placed a folded towel on the mat and the baggies on the towel. My thermometer read a steady 88 degrees. I think there might have been too much heat. I would appreciate any insight you mighy have on my problem

5/7/2003 1:28:41 AM

Cologne / Germany

Your germination method was correct, but 84 deg would be perfect although 88 is not too hot in my opinion.
In general you don´t need to care about the seed leaves. Are you sure it´s not the rest of the endosperm from inside the seed shell covering your leaves? It will be away soon.
Wait for the first true leaves, if they are also deformed the plant might have genetic defects.

5/7/2003 5:02:00 AM

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

I don't know what it's called (someone here will), but all the seeds I've germinated had a light layer of "skin" on the cots. It looked like a thin layer of onion skin. Very common & normal. Plants use these skins as a form of lubrication. It allows the rapidly expanding cots to escape the seed shell halves without getting all torn up. Remember that in nature, no one files the edges.
Now that the seedlings are up, it is time to *gradually* lower the humidity of their environment. The skin then dries up & should fall off by itself. I helped a couple of mine out of curiosity & it caused no harm.
Could this be what you're seeing?

Steve

5/7/2003 7:40:27 AM

Utah

Tim1-
what did you soak them in, just water ?

5/7/2003 9:14:08 AM

Sacramento, Ca USA

Thanks for the replies folks. This is not the thin membrain that you see on the leaves when the emerge. It's bright white, in most cases it through the entire thickness of the leaf and when I let the leaf mature the white area cracks around the edges and a hole is left in the middle of the leaf.

Yes, I soaked the seeds in plain old tap water.

5/7/2003 11:58:24 AM

Cologne / Germany

Hole in the middle? That happened to me a few weeks ago. There was too much moisture and air in the jars where I put the seeds to germinate. First the seed case opened (without any root before) so the moisture got in. That might have caused rot to the endosperm first, then to the leaves. They were white and mushy, the plants died.
I just spray some water onto cosmetic pads (batting), open them, put the seed in and store them in ziplock baggies. Press the air out of the bags before closing and keep the seed close to the pad so the case won´t open but the tip comes out. I never had problems with this method.

5/7/2003 12:19:42 PM

Phoenix Az

I had my 748.5 kolb do the same thing.

5/7/2003 3:37:33 PM

Wroclaw, Poland (51 N, 17 E)

One of two first leaves of my 840 desrosiers is a little bit deformed too. And some leaves of other pumpkins are geting white on the edges. I don't know what to do, maybe do nothing?

5/7/2003 5:56:42 PM

syracuse, ny

hmmm. another phenomenon presented us by the AG!
i have had the same thing on a few of my seedlings as well.
i suppose that as long as the first true leaf says 'hello'
nice and loud, yer okay! but keep trying to find out what causes this....maybe something new like SARS....hope not...

5/7/2003 7:17:32 PM

Kansas

My cotes on the 840 derosiers were also deformed, but my stem broke in two so the plant passed away. The 845 Nesbitt that i started also has deformed cotes..?? No true leaves yet so i'm hoping they look good when they emerge.-Shawn.

5/7/2003 7:58:04 PM

Lake Stevens, WA, USA

You will get "deformed" leaves if you over-file the edges of the seeds. If the edges look rough, and almost torn looking (jagged edges) you probably filed too much. There is literally a very thin line (it's light brown in color) between adequate filing, and over filing.

David

5/7/2003 10:24:43 PM

Sacramento, Ca USA

You Know, I may have filed the seeds too far. I'll be careful with that and see what happens next time.

5/7/2003 11:39:30 PM

Montoursville, PA

Think David has the correct answer! Think it should have nothing to do with true leaf emergence and growth. Only other thing I see would be a chemical burn from a soaking medium that is pushed to hard or soaked to long.

5/8/2003 9:08:42 AM

Chico, Ca

Maybe the interior of the seed is damaged while we firmly grasp it file the edges prior to planting.

5/9/2003 12:08:10 AM

Appalachian Mtns.

I filed heavily with my first go-round of seeds. Most came up deformed and with the shell still attached even though I planted sideways. This would lead to the conclusion that over-filing did it.

My 2nd go-round was with seed that was unfiled, soaked in H2O2 for 2-4 hours. Most of those have deformed cots as well, but shed the seed coats better for the most part.

Bottom line...don't worry about deformed cots. They're gone soon and don't seem to affect the growth of the plant, at least not with mine. I had a Beachy 846 Calai replicant that came up with 1/2 of each cot torn off from underground as the plant was emerging...it's growing just fine.

5/18/2003 6:41:51 AM

Appalachian Mtns.

Pic of the ripped cots on the Beachy in my diary.

5/18/2003 6:50:13 AM